Sample South Heavenly Ballot
Participants
/2434/
General Opinion: cooler climate with criteria, criteria for islands.
- Posts: >>42033296 >>42035200 >>42105469 >>42364162 >>42367445
/NijiMales/
General Opinion: cooler climate with criteria, criteria for islands.
- Posts: >>42034702 >>42364148 >>42367432
/LazuLight/
General Opinion: cooler climate with special criteria listed below, criteria for islands listed below.
- Posts: >>42363380 >>42363886 >>42365010 >>42367109
/NijiEN/
General Opinion: cooler climate, what the thread wants on islands.
- Posts: >>42097633 >>42364813 >>42367317
Anya-Petra Global
General Opinion: what the thread wants.
- Posts: >>42363692 >>42364263 >>42367185
/haha/
General Opinion: what the thread wants.
- Posts: >>42366807 >>42368086
Regional Settlements
Within our region, we came to the following conclusions about the islands shown here:
- This island lore wise is tied to watamelon, and while it makes sense for it to change hands in lore, we need the approval of the writer for Watamelon.
- This island is Pomeranian.
- This island is under Tsukinode Control, but is culturally Pentomo.
Global Ballots and Recommendations
1. Climate
NOTICE: /vrt/ made their ideas clear here, which are being supported by NijiMales and others: >>42032467
Going over it, most are fine with it.
The LazuLight writer wrote:
My only concerns are how this makes much of NijiEN subtropic monsoon when I would have prefered it to be Cfa or Oceanic personally. I also am concerned regarding some nations outside of this like /kr/. However, I disagree with Retro's assessment of using two different models. Truth is, if we change, we cannot have two different models in use in different parts. Instead, people like Z, Climeat, Clocks and others can find ways to help them get a reasonable change. Also, I am going against the grain here and saying that magical climate is not totally bad and we must also understand that people come to this thread to have fun and build a nation that they envision. While there is kino lore to be found in cases like /rose/, we should not expect everyone to be as good as Rosebro or want to do that. Some people have visions for their nation that have climate in a certain ways. My suggestion with magic climate is you must adapt it to the Chuubanite mechanics, justify it, and don't make it ridiculous like turning a rainforest into tundra. Spec bio can help, but not everyone likes spec bio or wants to deal in it too much. To repeat, this project is ultimately for fun, and while I was a bastion of "realism" in the past, I think that writers should be given some grace. After all, we have meat killing jannies, Risuners magically being the best sailors in the world, and all MCs, including Pomerlane, having extreme plot armor.
NijiMales Wrote:
I will make my stance clear that I support the new climate system with the way retro described it as well since this isn't a real-world simulator. I like it overall personally.
The others had no real opinion on it worth noting beyond that they expressed their support or indifference. In a real vote, this would need to be clarified more likely, but I think that we as a group agree to the cooler climate with the following suggestions made by the LazuLight writer and the NijiMales writer as considerations. Thus, Aye with Conditions listed (or abstain with those conditions proposed.)
2. Islands
NOTICE: /vrt/ made their ideas clear here, which are being supported by NijiMales, 2434, LazuLight, and others: >>42032467 >>42136080
It appears that most in the thread have no idea what in the world this question was asking but we appear to understand. The general opinion has yet to be determined beyond support for what LazuLight writer wrote:
I think most of you are not understanding what the islands discussion is about. It's not solely about Retro sharing one random island but about how we approach the 3.0 islands as a whole and what criterion should be given to someone who wants to claim one. I support Alice's idea of them changing hands repeatedly in history, but that doesn't mean that all islands need to be owned or occupied per se. Some islands IRL are inhospitable for various reasons, and these islands likely have native populations on them in some form. You want to do something interesting? Create original content about some island. I get for nations like Moriji, Tsukinode, Hoshiyomia, Retro Reich, Kanaruca, and Nasfaq wanting to hold islands for resupply purposes, that makes sense to me perfectly. But this leads to a debate about colonialism that maybe we should also have.
I think the basic way of thinking of this should be.
- Have lore reasons for it, such as Retro's idea.
- Have it make sense in a world perspective. While landlock nations can certainly have some random island, I personally think said nations would really need to provide greater explanations because (I am contradicting myself) things need to make sense. It's not impossible. Courland IRL, a tiny baltic nation, owned colonies in the Caribbean for example and the City of Augsburg owned Venezuela at one point (It gets its name from the Klein-Venedig in German, or Little Venice.) What I am basically saying is create a really cool and well thought out reason especially if you are a landlocked nation or nation that doesn't have much of a martime tradition like Dråkenland, which according to our famous Dragoon, has a fleet of a few fishing vessels :)
- Wars and peace treaties can change ownership of said islands like happened IRL.
- Create OC content for some islands like /mhm/ rep proposed with the Knights of Ailivia.
- Remember that this isn't about powergaming, but lore creation. Whether or not the Retro Reich owns an island in the middle of the Kizuna Ocean or Hoshi owns one there too shouldn't be something that should be concerning in any powergaming sense. Powergaming is lame, and if we want wars and relations to be more "open", we need to remove the concept of powergaming from our lexicon and furthermore correct those who actually are powergaming.
Nijimales writer also wrote:
Islands... I think that the first step is to decide what islands were are even talking about, as in showing them on the map and what territorial waters are. I remember Alice's proposal for territorial waters being accepted by most but morig has their own definition. Do we consider the at large concept or base it one what a nation thinks. I lean to the former just because while a nation can set its own waters, we cannot reasonably apply that to all nations.
2434 writer also wrote:
As for the islands, agreed with what retro said but also want to add that I also think there is no problem with Islands swaping hands as time goes along as they did IRL in many such cases.
As with the former, the others have no real opinions on it beyond what the thread as a whole wants. Also in a real vote, it is likely this would need to be clarified as we do not know how this would count in a regional ballot but I think that the general support would mean we agree but put forwards the suggests on Nijimales, 2434 and LazuLight. Thus, Aye with Conditions listed (or abstain with those conditions proposed.)
Conclusion
If I may offer some conjecture, the South Heavenly Group works well as a whole because in my opinion our long tradition of working together as a whole. However, what is apparent to me is that this system needs to have people, or one person step up to take a leadership style role within a group discussion. This could be a problem in many groups, and that is something that cannot be fixed with any measure other than people being willing to step up.
Furthermore, the period of 10 days I think is too short, and there needs to be at least 2 weeks of discussion on votes going forward, aside from regional settlements that can be settled at any time between the members of the region.
I also see an issue regarding the choices in that we really did not have a voteanon clarify what was being talked about overall, especially regarding the islands. That is a major issue, and going forward, we can never just literally have something as vague as "3.0 Islands", where only a few actually remember what the whole debate was before and also was complicated because it actually appears as if no one properly tried to explain, even those who did know. This is unacceptable in my opinion.
The South Heavenly Group will try to obtain a group name, and perhaps decide between themselves what tiers they are and chuuni names for them if they wish.